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Process for wp:AFC accept when the target is a redirect?

What is the process for accepting an article when the the target is currently a redirect? Tag the redirect with this and move the AfC draft to mainspace after the redirect has been deleted under G6.

wherever you want it to appear.

Hi North8000. Hope you are keeping well. Can you please review this article, as I added two additional references and let me know if its good to move to main space. If you have any suggestions for similar articles kindly let me know. Also I will add relevant references for similar articles for other cities and take your approval before moving them to main space. Thanks in advance. Gardenkur (talk) 13:16, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Per our discussion above, I wanted to address 2 "development authority" articles at the same time. Could we do it that way......i.e. give me a link to a second one when you are ready? North8000 (talk) 14:47, 10 August 2022 (UTC) Added bolding 8/19/22. North8000 (talk) 19:21, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Sorry for the confusion earlier. You can review this development authority. Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 03:43, 20 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi North8000. Sorry for the reminder again as I added few more references to one more development authority. You can review this development authority. Thanks. Gardenkur

Hi North8000. Hope you are keeping as its been long time having seen any message from you. You can review this development authority. Thanks. Gardenkur

Hi North8000. Sure will do. Sorry saw the message late. Will do accordingly. Gardenkur (talk) 10:03, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi North8000. You can review this article too.Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 07:09, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi North8000. You can review this article. Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 11:54, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur: I mentioned another development authority article because I also wanted to deal with the commonalities. Do you have another development authority" one? Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 19:21, 19 August 2022 (UTC) North8000 (talk) 02:11, 20 August 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Sorry to remind you. Can you please review above two development authority articles to move them to main space. Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 00:31, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi North8000. Hope you are keeping fine as it has been some time since I saw your communication last. Sorry to remind you. If you kindly advise me on above articles which are in draft stage, I can slowly start moving them to main stage to clean my draft section. Thanks in advance. Gardenkur (talk) 02:20, 7 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, I didn't realize that you had provided two development authority articles as I requested. Will do. North8000 (talk) 13:50, 7 September 2022 (UTC)

Recapping, @Gardenkur: the two development authority articles are: Draft:New Town Kolkata Development Authority (NKDA) and Draft:Nazira Development Authority. I'm starting the work now. North8000 (talk) 21:29, 14 September 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Hope you are keeping well. It has been more than a month since I have submitted few articles for your review. Could you please complete it asap and let me know your feedback. Need to clean my draft space too or I will have many articles at a time to handle not to loose them out of draft. Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 02:59, 7 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur: I did a substantial amount of work looking at those two articles and then became so busy/buried in real life that I've not had any substantial time for Wikipedia, nor will I until approx October 24th. IMO I know what should happen on those, but it will take me about 1 hour that I don't have to politely and respectfully explain and support what I have to say, including with our differences in native languages. I could give you the short version now if you wish and describe it in more detail later if our wish. Those two articles are about 95% an exact copy of each other (and I think that this is probably the case with all of your development authority articles). And the "95%" which is copied between them is about development authorities in India in general, not about the the particular development authority which is the topic of the article. And for those two, the other 5% is basically trivial information about the specific development authority which probably shouldn't even be in Wikipedia. In my opinion what you should do is create a nice article about Development Authorities in India in general. And if you have some non-trivial information about the development authority in a particular city, you could put information into the article about that city. And then I'd suggest getting your other development authority articles in draft space deleted. You should not feel bad about not having a large quantity of articles created. I've had about 68,000 Wikipedia edits since 2009, about half of them in article space including taking one of them through Good Article, Featured Article and worldwide "article of the day". And I've only created about 20 new articles, with only about half of those being technically new articles. You are just getting started and have hundreds of new articles and I think are running into the inevitable issues from that and it would be good for you to make the adjustment in your approach. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 12:04, 7 October 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Thanks for your detailed reply with guidance and sorry for disturbing you in middle of your issues. In such case can we redirect respective development authorities not confirming to notability to those cities. In this case if anyone wants information or is creating new articles on that name later, can see it as available in this platform. I have created these initially to update unique information for each authority as History, Chairman,location of office,email and website to reach them as informational tool to public. Iam sure in future someone will keep creating them. Thanks again. Gardenkur (talk) 12:23, 7 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur: I'd support and help in that plan. Just clarifying, right now we're only talking about the development authority articles. Again, I'll be mostly off wiki until October 24th. But we could start by you picking one of those articles and we could work through the details. Also, I'd probably ask for a 2nd opinion on the plan at NPP. And later do them all. North8000 (talk) 16:54, 7 October 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Thanks for your support and opinion. We will proceed as you guide and do accordingly. Presently will post here all development authority of small towns and villages which doesnot have notability. Thanks again. Gardenkur (talk) 03:35, 8 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

November 2022 work[edit]

Hi North8000. Below are the few devekopment authorities of middle scale towns which you can review and redirect to respective towns or cities.

1. Nazira Development Authority Done (in late October) North8000 (talk) 18:31, 18 November 2022 (UTC)

2. Jorhat Development authority Done North8000 (talk) 18:25, 18 November 2022 (UTC)

3. Sivasagar Development Authority Done North8000 (talk) 18:37, 18 November 2022 (UTC)

4. Tinsukia Development Authority Done North8000 (talk) 18:41, 18 November 2022 (UTC)

5. Puttaparthy Urban Development Authority Done North8000 (talk) 18:51, 18 November 2022 (UTC)

The municipal corporations are larger administrative bodies than development authorities. Would prefer them for main space but will wait for your opinion.thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 12:30, 10 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi North8000. Hope you are keeping well and back for review. When free request you to start the review process and guide me accordingly.Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 12:19, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur: Thanks for the post. I'm back now and trying to catch up. I'll get started on those. Will take the first one as a test/example. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 15:44, 25 October 2022 (UTC)

@Gardenkur: I did one (New Town) to see how it goes. North8000 (talk) 17:54, 27 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur: I also did Nazira North8000 (talk) 19:33, 27 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi North8000. Thanks for giving a start on these articles. Will move as per your guidance. Gardenkur (talk) 22:09, 27 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur:I'd also be happy to move them if you make a list. The one advantage is that I can immediately mark them as reviewed.North8000 (talk) 16:10, 28 October 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Hope you are keeping well. Sorry for the delay in communication as I was busy in other activities. The below are the list of new articles for review from your side to move them to main space.

1.Imphal Municipal Corporation.

2.Shivamogga City Corporation.

3.Mathura Vrindavan Municipal Corporation.

4.Badangpet Municipal Corporation.

5.Moradabad Municipal Corporation.

7.Bettiah Municipal Corporation.

11.Tumakuru City Corporation.

12.Meerpet Municipal Corporation.

13.Gorakhpur Municipal Corporation.

14.Saharanpur Municipal Corporation.

15.Bareilly Municipal Corporation.

To clean my draft space I submit above articles for your review. You can review and decide as you feel appropriate.Thanks.Gardenkur (talk) 08:19, 17 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur: So I think that the "development authority" should pretty clearly not be separate articles and I'll convert those to redirects. I will try to figure out / discuss with you what to do on the municipal corporation articles. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 17:52, 17 November 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Thanks for your reply and also submit below articles as part of clean up process for your review.

16.Kota (South) Municipal Corporation.

17.Kota (North) Municipal Corporation.

18.Jodhpur (South) Municipal Corporation.

19.Jodhpur (North) Municipal Corporation.

20.Ajmer Municipal Corporation.

21.Kapurthala Municipal Corporation.

22.Phagwara Municipal Corporation.

23.Abohar Municipal Corporation.

24.Pathankot Municipal Corporation.

25.Hoshiarpur Municipal Corporation.

Thanks in advance.

@Gardenkur: You deleted your last post including your new additions to the list. Did you intend to do that? Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 19:27, 19 November 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Iam really sorry if it has been accidentally deleted and if you can restore it. It was not intentional.Thanks.Gardenkur (talk) 01:27, 20 November 2022 (UTC) Do I need to give missing articles name again here.Gardenkur (talk) 06:22, 20 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi North8000.Hope you are keeping fine.Following additional articles for your review.

26. Jalandhar Municipal CorporationShahjahanpur Municipal Corporation

27.Sambalpur Municipal Corporation

28.Aizawl Municipal Corporation

29.Morena Municipal Corporation

30.Murwara Municipal Corporation

31.Rewa Municipal Corporation to be redirected to Rewa Municipal Corporation

32.Ratlam Municipal Corporation

33.Dewas Municipal Corporation

34.Sagar Municipal Corporation

35.Vijayapura Mahanagara Palike

36.Ballari Mahanagara Palike

37.Bihar Sharif Municipal Corporation

38.Hazaribagh Municipal Corporation

39.Adityapur Municipal Corporation

40.Deoghar Municipal Corporation

41.Chas Municipal Corporation

42.Jamshedpur Municipal Corporation

43.Yamunanagar Municipal Corporation

44.Panchkula Municipal Corporation

45.Corporation of the City of Panaji

46.Risali Municipal Corporation

47.Bhilai Charoda Municipal Corporation

48.Chirmiri Municipal Corporation

49.Birgaon Municipal Corporation

50.Dhamtari Municipal Corporation

51.Ambikapur Municipal Corporation

Thanks in advance. Gardenkur (talk) 13:27, 21 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur: Hello Gardenkur! For development authority articles it was easy to decide because I was 100% certain that they should not exist as separate articles. They did not contain suitable sources to establish wp:notability of the topic and IMO it unlikely that such sources don't exist. So a core guideline dictates that result. Also, there was essentially no good material in there that was unique to the development authority of the particular city. Typically there was just a sentence or two about a minor event. So there was no issue with simply converting to a redirect without trying to transfer any material to the city article.

Things are very slightly different for the Municipal corporation articles. The articles don't have sources to establish wp:notability, but, since the municipal corporation is basically another name for the government of the city, one could argue that such sources exist. So it's not a clear absolute that wp:notability prohibits existence as a separate article. I took a look at a few of the articles. They have the same issue that about 98% of the material is "boilerplate" about India Municipal corporations in general and 2% is some facts (like the names of the people currently holding offices) which could potentially be good material for the city article. So each of these is basically a "sub article" to the city article but with only a very tiny bit of content. Although the core guideline doesn't clearly dictate it, in my opinion these shouldn't exist as separate articles and I would not be comfortable with moving them into mainspace as articles. I see these as the possibilities:

1. I think that the best scenario would be to take the small amount of unique material (and sources for it) and moving it to the the corresponding city article. You would need to be the one to do the "move material" work because I don't have enough wiki-minutes to take on that work. Do you want to do that "move" work?
2. If not, my #2 choice would be for me to simple convert the articles into redirects as I did with the development authority articles.
3. The other possibility is for you to just do whatever you wish to do next with these without my involvement.

What do you think?

Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 00:39, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Thanks for your detailed response. I understand that the articles on Municipal Corporation are bit confusing on meeting wp:notability, but being the governing agencies of town these are important corporations.You can atleast move some of them where I added relevant references and they meet the Wikipedia policies. In case of others I will add more references. However they are created on guidance from constitution of India by notification in official gazette to improve the cities. Also the administrative offices of these institutions are important informational requirements.Gardenkur (talk) 13:36, 29 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think that you understood my post. Here is what the main points were:

• "Policy" dictated that the development authority articles shouldn't exist, and so I just implemented "policy" and turned them into redirects.
• "Policy" does not dictate what should happen with the municipal corporation articles. So I am just giving my opinion. My opinion is that the facts that are unique to (only for) that particular corporation should be moved to the corresponding city article and then the municipal corporation articles converted into a redirect to the city article. This would be possibility #1. So I listed this and three other possibilities and asked your opinion. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 18:57, 29 November 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. Hope you are keeping well. Starting from 1 iam adding additional references to make it more Wikipedia notable. Kindly have a look during your free time and guide me accordingly.Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 02:19, 7 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Gardenkur: I still don't think that you understand my post. I will say it shorter and more directly but my apologies if that makes it sound rude. The municipal corporation articles probably to no violate wp:notability. But for the reasons give, it is my mere opinion that they should be merged into the city articles, and so I don't want to personally move them as articles into article space. So I gave choice #1, #2 and #3 above. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 21:58, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000. I will move Municipal Corporations after adding more related reliable references. Also kindly guide me on Electricity Regulatory Commissions. Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 12:17, 14 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Arbitrary break 2[edit]

Hi North8000. Thanks for your reply. I understood your suggestions. However, I feel that once moved to main space these articles will be subject to more additions on their geographical area,opportunities and challenges of each of these corporations and other relative information in the coming days. To make it more suitable to Wikipedia policies on articles for mainspace I am adding these references. There are already some of similar articles existing in Wikipedia platform and some point in future Iam sure someone will draft on these corporations. Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 11:33, 9 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe I'll move them as articles. I'm going to ask for advice at NPP. North8000 (talk) 15:38, 9 December 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000, I'm writing to follow up about this section of the Wikilawyering essay:

Unlike Wikipedia, the legal world is 90% about technicalities, and a part of a lawyer's job to achieve a result using technicalities. So "wikilawyering" merely means taking a practice that is a good idea in the legal world and moving it into Wikipedia where it is a bad idea.

I think the essay would be stronger without this text, although I appreciate your attempt to edit this section after I added a 'dubious' tag in a cheeky moment when the original text once again kept me from considering whether to cite the essay in a discussion.

From my view, a lawyer primarily works with facts and laws, not "technicalities", to represent the interests of their client. What are sometimes complained about as classic "technicalities", e.g. there was a search when technically a warrant should have been obtained (therefore the evidence found is excluded), or a suspect in custody is questioned even though they technically should have first been informed of their right to remain silent and to have an attorney (requiring whatever they said to be inadmissible), or a defendant was technically entitled to a competent attorney (and therefore entitled to a new trial), can actually be fundamental rights, e.g. the Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Amendments to the U.S. Constitution. There are cases that appear more technical, e.g. that depend on what the meaning of "is" is, but I don't think that is what the gist of the essay is describing as disruptive behavior.

I make a distinction by thinking of Wikipedia as the "client", which I think can be helpful for warding off inconsistent interpretations of P&Gs based on personal preference. Overall, I think the focus on "technicalities" in the essay may be misplaced, because the essay seems more focused on the misuse of P&Gs in ways that may implicate conduct policies. Perhaps the essay could be revised to clarify the meaning of 'technicality' in the context of Wikipedia, because the term seems to be used as a shorthand for using P&Gs to achieve objectives that are contrary to the spirit and fundamental principles of the encyclopedia. Beccaynr (talk) 13:45, 20 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Beccaynr: Thanks for the post. You should take a peek at how it was before I started working on it and also read the talk page from then. . "Wikilawyering" in Wikipedia was defined categorically much more severely, and lawyers / that profession was treated much broadly negative. I softened both up. The term is deeply entrenched in Wikipedia, and inevitably refers to a negative. And BTW, while everything that you said about the profession is true, I think that undeniably so is "using technicalities". And the entrenched Wiki meaning clearly refers to the "using technicalities". Unless you would advocate deletion of the essay, I think that it is kind and positive that it can be in the context of the meaning in Wikipedia. On another note , IMO the most common use of Wikilawyering is to POV an article. This can be mild situations and IMO the term needs to be usable for mild situations. While one could argue that POV'ing article is "working against the aims of Wikpedia", the latter is a broader and more severe accusation and I think that the term needs to be usable for milder cases without that escalation. So I think that something "invoking policy or guideline for other than it's intended purpose" says that well, and also is a reminder of how P&G's are used and are supposed to be used in Wikipedia....for the intended purpose. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 02:45, 21 November 2022 (UTC)

Hi North8000, I decided to write on your Talk page because I had reviewed some of the edit history and noticed you had added the content [1]. I think it should be removed because it seems distracting from the main points of the essay. It also does not seem kind nor positive, because it is a stereotype typically perpetuated in service of the denial of civil rights.

I also don't think a culture of broad negativity towards attorneys on Wikipedia is sufficient to support the specific content, even if the culture still exists, and maybe it should stop if it does. As a lawyer, I think the term 'wikilawyering' is great, but I don't think attorneys should be inaccurately portrayed to make the point about wikiconduct, and I think a more accurate portrayal of the legal profession can make the point more clearly.

So I'm not advocating for deletion of the essay, because I think it can be improved by removing the inaccurate POV I noted above, and I think it would help to have a little more precision in how the essay communicates its core concepts. But we can continue the discussion on the essay Talk page to seek more input from other editors - I just wanted to start by chatting with you because it is one of your contributions to the essay. Thank you, Beccaynr (talk) 03:48, 21 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not married to any particular wording. I am to keeping a couple of core things:

• Should include using P&G's for other than their intended purpose
• Should include / acknowledge non-severe forms

And just noting, it needs to explain the wikipedia term.

Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 04:04, 21 November 2022 (UTC)

Of course! and I will try to draft some proposed text over the next few days for a little more precision in the wording. Cheers, Beccaynr (talk) 04:11, 21 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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Done North8000 (talk) 15:51, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

	Happy belated Thanksgiving!
	Happy belated Thanksgiving to an old friend. Hope you snag some good black Friday deals for Christmas! P.S. you have some cool photos on your user page, and a duplicate photo of Notre Dame just FYI. Huggums537 (talk) 15:53, 25 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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Done North8000 (talk) 21:28, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 21:47, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 21:05, 21 December 2022 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 17:34, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 21:11, 24 December 2022 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 21:22, 24 December 2022 (UTC)

Hey North, glad to speak to you again. I hope you're doing amazing. Recently, it was announced that Wikimedia would conduct its third conference in India, between 28-30 April 2023 in Hyderabad, Telangana. I felt like I should be taking part in it since I reside in the same country. Can you help me out with the process of registration and what will be my purpose of going there? Like can I just attend it as a spectator since it will be my first time? I'd be really helpful. Regards. Below is the link pertaining to the conference.

side note: I am blocked on Wiki commons, will it somehow affect the registration?

• Wiki Conference India 2023.

And Merry Christmas to you and your family. :) Derivator2017 (talk) 10:37, 25 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Derivator2017: Thanks for the compliment of assuming I know so many things. Unfortunately I don't know anything about the conference. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 16:28, 25 December 2022 (UTC)

CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 17:30, 25 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

		Happy Holidays
		Hello, I wish you the very best during the holidays. And I hope you have a very happy 2023! Bruxton (talk) 18:01, 25 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

– Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year}} to user talk pages.

CAPTAIN RAJU(T) 22:48, 31 December 2022 (UTC)[reply] 

		The New Page Reviewer's Bronze Award
		For over 1,000 article reviews during 2022. Well done! Keep up the good work! -MPGuy2824 (talk) 03:07, 2 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@MPGuy2824: Thanks! North8000 (talk) 15:37, 2 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

   Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year fireworks}} to user talk pages.

— Moops ^⋠T⋡ 22:40, 2 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sending a lot of these is what I was blocked for. :(

Anyway, Happy New Year North8000. Keep up the great work. — Moops ^⋠T⋡ 22:40, 2 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Moops: Thanks for the compliment! Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 18:53, 3 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I forgot to ping you at Wikipedia:Village pump (policy)#Summary of discussion so far.

So, this is your ping.  ;)     — The Transhumanist   01:13, 13 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@The Transhumanist: Thanks! North8000 (talk) 03:51, 14 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Since you cannot decipher the diffs, I'll be happy to do step-by-step edits for your edification. The result will be the same. Just stay out until I'm done. Grorp (talk) 04:14, 14 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Grorp: Not that you can make that demand, but it's fine with me. And stop making false accusations of edit warring. Nobody has crossed that line yet but you are much closer to it. It's a highly contentious article with significant warranted concerns about COI edits by Scientology folks. A massive bundle of individually un-revertable edits is a way to remove scrutiny by making it too time consuming (not the BS "cannot decipher" crap) to review/deal with which is not appropriate in this case. And so a more incremental approach is common practice for these cases, not for my "edification" Please unbundle into individually revertible edits with edit summaries, or take it to talk if you disagree with that approach. I don't know the situation with regards to yourself, but if you are simply NPOV working to improve the article, thank you for your efforts. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 04:29, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

If you have no prior knowledge of my editing work in the Wikipedia pages of Scientology, then I invite you to look at my edit history (contributions). FYI, tiny-steps-edits are not my style and don't fit with the way my brain works while trying to update out-of-date articles. When I feel there might be blowback on an edit, I usually have more to say than can fit in an edit summary and direct readers to the talk page. The rest of my edits are pretty recognizable and/or non-controversial. By now, I'm pretty sure you've been able to see that the edits I had made in that article were not controversial at all.

Most of the Scientology articles were written in the flush of massive public interest around 2008 when Anonymous came on the scene to protest Scientology. Many of the articles have little "digs" that aren't really appropriate for an encyclopedia, and are not necessary for readers to understand the subject. As such, a lot of the 'see also' and 'external links' sections are bloated with redirection to other (usually negative) articles of Scientology which are unrelated to the topic of the page. Citations have aged and need their URLs updated from current websites or copies gotten from online archives. Many articles suffer from "too many cooks" (including enthusiastic additions by critics and careful excisions by Scientologists) and no longer make any sense when you read them; those need straightening out.

The article Scientology status by country has been on my list of things to work on, but Xxxxx's edit took me there and one thing led to another. I hope my transfigured incrementals makes sense to you. Don't, however, expect incrementals from me as a custom. It is my hope that you will recognize the style and worth of my edits and see my good faith efforts to improve the encyclopedia and be willing to try to decipher atypical diffs rather than request exhaustive explanations. Grorp (talk) 05:22, 14 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Grorp:} Thanks for the ping, the explanation and your work. My points remain the same and so I won't repeat them. IMO my comments regarding large bundles of edits on controversial article might be useful to you. It ended up well including your most recent set of edits and so again, thanks for your work. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 22:12, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 16:04, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

Ten years ago, you were found precious. That's what you are, always. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:41, 18 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Gerda Arendt: Thanks! I try. North8000 (talk) 00:49, 23 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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Here you deleted a comment I made during a thread on Trickle-down economics at NPOVN. Can you please tell me what was inappropriate about my comment? Thanks! --Jayron32 19:55, 31 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Jayron32: I wanted to give you a quick response. Going into a meeting in 10 minutes and may not be able to fix until about 2 hours from now. It was my screw-up and I don't know how I made that error. Please accept my apologies. I'll fix or else feel free to beat me to it. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 20:02, 31 January 2023 (UTC)

Your last addition was fantastic. I've been trying to make this point for awhile and I think your example is the best one so far. We need to be very careful discussing impacts because we are validating the concept in wikivoice. The welfare queen example is perfect. If we say this is the impact, we de facto are calling them welfare queens through synth. Good response! Squatch347 (talk) 20:10, 1 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Squatch347: Thanks! I have an interest in this term-related structurally more than NPOV. In this case it has NPOV impact. In other cases it sows eternal confusion at the article even when there is no NPOV issue. North8000 (talk) 20:16, 1 February 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 23:16, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 23:21, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 20:54, 16 February 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 21:02, 16 February 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 00:25, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 00:34, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

@Nikkimaria: Thanks. It was my pleasure. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 21:59, 4 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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DoneNorth8000 (talk) 15:26, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

The relevant text is in the pink box located at the WP:3RR hyperlink - An edit or a series of consecutive edits that undoes or manually reverses other editors' actions—whether in whole or in part—counts as a revert.

Best. Newimpartial (talk) 21:29, 7 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I read that differently. That if a combination of consecutive edits is a revert, it's still a revert even if each one alone is not. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 21:42, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

I hear what you're saying, but given the very generous way individual edits are interpteted as reverts in general, it isn't clear to me how a revert could emerge in the aggregate from edits that are not themselves reverts, considered separately. But in any event, the "case law" at WP:3RRN is fairly clear that consecutive edits always count as only a single revert. Newimpartial (talk) 21:49, 7 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hello North8000,

You recently offered a statement in a request for arbitration. The Arbitration Committee has accepted that request for arbitration and an arbitration case has been opened at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/World War II and the history of Jews in Poland. Evidence that you wish the arbitrators to consider should be added to the evidence subpage, at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/World War II and the history of Jews in Poland/Evidence. Please add your evidence by April 04, 2023, which is when the first evidence phase closes. Submitted evidence will be summarized by Arbitrators and Clerks at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/World War II and the history of Jews in Poland/Evidence/Summary. Owing to the summary style, editors are encouraged to submit evidence in small chunks sooner rather than more complete evidence later.

Details about the summary page, the two phases of evidence, a timeline and other answers to frequently asked questions can be found at the case's FAQ page.

For a guide to the arbitration process, see Wikipedia:Arbitration/Guide to arbitration.

For the Arbitration Committee,
~ ToBeFree (talk) 00:12, 14 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hello North8000,

Just a quick note to greet you outside of a noticeboard discussion.

I appreciated your recent comment at the COIN thread [2] that there is something tangible, in certain closely examined cases, between "strongly discouraged" and "forbidden" re COI editing. Part of the community seems to be using the "wikilawyering" charge to shut down any thoughtful exploration of that gap, which I find egregiously unjust.

You make the comment above that "too often Wikipedia is a nasty place". I feel this, and may or may not resume editing the encyclopaedia.

In case it's of interest, I made some general comments re my concerns about the editor experience, and tendentious applications of WP policy, in my statement at my user page. [3]

I found the content and tone of your contribution to that thread refreshing.

Sincerely, Walton22 (talk) 21:50, 15 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Walton22: Thanks for the post and compliment. I really don't enough about the situation to have an opinion. The universe of Wikipedia editing can be a weird alternate universe and often a rough and tumble or nasty one. I don't have the wiki-minutes to take a deep broad dive, but if I can ever advise or help, let me know. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 14:55, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

@North8000: Thank you very much. I was happy to just make broad brush strokes now by way of this introduction, but I do very much appreciate the offer to counsel a little in the future if need be. "Alternate universe" is right! There is great potential for justice here, and indeed I see it happen often. Walton22 (talk) 16:23, 16 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

you should check the spelling of Sarah Vaugn's name in your gallery. Carptrash (talk) 18:38, 30 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Carptrash: Thanks. It looks like I have it (Vaughan) right. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 18:56, 30 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

And while I have you here, what do you think of Bessie Smith & Ma Rainey as folk singers? I say "No" but it is always nice to meet a bold person who is actually willing to make the edits. Carptrash (talk) 19:15, 30 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Carptrash: I have no expertise on them but their articles make zero mention of such and so I'd say no. North8000 (talk) 19:19, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

FYI, the ping in your reply at ANI won't work. See the documentation at Template:Ping#Usage for more info. Cheers. XAM2175 ^(T) 21:56, 6 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@XAM2175: Thanks. There was one where I did it wrong and then fixed it a few minutes later. Is that the one that you are referring to? or did I make another error.  :-) North8000 (talk) 14:11, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

It's this edit at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents § Proposal to Indef DBachmann. The entire point of my message is that you can't fix it – the ping only works if all of these conditions are fulfilled in the edit where you place the ping template:

• The edit must add new lines of text, not just edit existing lines.
• The edit must be signed by adding ~~~~ to the end of the message.
• The edit must either be entirely within an existing section (it cannot have new section headers in the middle) or start a new section (starts with a new section header).
• The number of users to be pinged must be equal to or less than 50.

Thus, if you forget to add a ping, or get it wrong, the easiest thing to do is revert your reply entirely and then add it again with a working ping. Cheers. XAM2175 ^(T) 18:37, 7 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@XAM2175:Thanks much for your post. I learned from it. I thought that you just needed a new signature and a new ping. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 22:58, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

No worries, glad I could help! 🙂 XAM2175 ^(T) 23:26, 7 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, I and others have proposed additional options at Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)#RfC_on_a_procedural_community_desysop. You may wish to review your position in that RfC. TonyBallioni (talk) 02:22, 20 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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Done North8000 (talk) 14:54, 27 April 2023 (UTC)

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Hey, did I accidentally ping you 3 times consecutively in my attempt to edit the Fox News RfC? If so, so sorry. Wait, wouldn't this talk page message make it 4? Oh no. -- Mebigrouxboy (talk) 03:51, 9 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Mebigrouxboy: I did get a couple of pings and it was bit confusing where they didn't go. Thanks for the pings and the post. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 12:19, 9 May 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 12:36, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

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You recently offered a statement in a request for arbitration. The Arbitration Committee has accepted that request for arbitration and an arbitration case has been opened at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Scottywong. Evidence that you wish the arbitrators to consider should be added to the evidence subpage, at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Scottywong/Evidence. Please add your evidence by June 21, 2023, which is when the evidence phase closes. You can also contribute to the case workshop subpage, Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Scottywong/Workshop. For a guide to the arbitration process, see Wikipedia:Arbitration/Guide to arbitration. For the Arbitration Committee, –MJL ‐Talk‐^☖ 19:22, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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Done. North8000 (talk) 13:39, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 13:39, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 18:51, 18 June 2023 (UTC)

You recently offered a statement in a request for arbitration. The Arbitration Committee has accepted that request for arbitration and an arbitration case has been opened at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/AlisonW. Evidence that you wish the arbitrators to consider should be added to the evidence subpage, at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/AlisonW/Evidence. Please add your evidence by June 30, 2023, which is when the evidence phase closes. For a guide to the arbitration process, see Wikipedia:Arbitration/Guide to arbitration. For the Arbitration Committee, Dreamy Jazz ^{talk to me | my contributions} 23:51, 21 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I think you may be misrepresenting me here. I am trying to abide by WP:CIVIL, as we all should. I find it troublesome, but perhaps it was just an accident? DN (talk) 04:24, 26 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Darknipples: I didn't write anything by accident nor did I write anything uncivil. I did civilly take issue with one thing that you said about those who feel opposite that you do but even that was just a sidebar to my post. From your apologetic post I think you are being sincere and so I would like to offer a thought that might be useful. I've familiar with TFD's work (for over a decade) and they are one of the most careful, non-emotional, academic and source-based editors that I've interacted with. Their arguments (and mine) are just trying to sort out / discuss the specific narrow topics that you opened the section with. I think that you are misreading this as being about some broader POV struggle. There's nobody there who likes the KKK. IMO there are people who want to make the KKK article be (just) about the KKK. What reinforced my thought about the possible misreading was that quote that you closed you post with is something the to me looks like excellent relevant material for the article but you seemed to mistakenly thinking that the people who want to exclude that (IMHO irrelevant) material that you opened the section with have some broader exclusion goals which they don't have. In short, you may be imagining a battle that does not exist. And that a good way to sort that out would be to not conflate the narrow topic of your post that started that section with the other topics that you are mentioning, and to use the test of relevance to the article to help sort things out. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 12:52, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

I'll clarify my so-called "absurd argument" for you. It's because it is excluding him, not entirely, but it's still exclusion. If that's how you want to interpret it, that's up to you. I clarified that I wasn't accusing anyone and that I was talking about under-representation, not disassociation. You seemingly used a misinterpretation as a means to discredit arguments I technically wasn't trying to make, which is a Straw man. That is not something I get bent out of shape over because it isn't typically uncivil. Where it crossed the line was calling it "absurd" (your word) which adds Appeal to ridicule on top of the misrepresentation. Now try to look at it from my perspective. If my response to you was..."I didn't write anything by accident nor did I write anything uncivil", what would you do? Would you still take the time to try to clear the air in effort to keep things CIVIL? Think about it, unfortunately I won't be responding on the article talk page until this gets sorted out. Cheers. DN (talk) 01:42, 27 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

BTW I don't mean to sound condescending, by linking those logical fallacies. I do agree with and respect the rest of your explanation, but I don't feel as though I am being acknowledged or understood properly, so when I respond sometimes I overcompensate. DN (talk) 02:31, 27 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Darknipples: There seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding. I NEVER said that you made an absurd argument. Let's let the actual words speak for themselves. Please review the following:

• You made the following statement: "While I don't agree with the explanations I've been given as to why excluding David Duke from the KKK article...."
• And I responded to /referred to that statement saying "you open with saying that somebody made the absurd argument to generally exclude David Duke from the article (which I don't see anyone having said anything like that)"

It is not abundantly clear that this is NOT calling your argument absurd? My complaint was that you were misstating the arguments of others in a way that makes them / their argument look absurd. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 13:51, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 20:34, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

The arbitration case Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/AlisonW has been closed, and the final decision is viewable at the case page. The following remedy has been enacted:

• For failure to meet the conduct standards expected of an administrator, AlisonW's administrative user rights are removed. She may regain them at any time via a successful request for adminship.

For the Arbitration Committee, Dreamy Jazz ^{talk to me | my contributions} 17:45, 16 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Discuss this at: Wikipedia talk:Arbitration Committee/Noticeboard#Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/AlisonW closed

You recently offered a statement in a request for arbitration. The Arbitration Committee has accepted that request for arbitration and an arbitration case has been opened at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/SmallCat dispute. Evidence that you wish the arbitrators to consider should be added to the evidence subpage, at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/SmallCat dispute/Evidence. Please add your evidence by August 4, 2023, which is when the evidence phase closes. You can also contribute to the case workshop subpage, Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/SmallCat dispute/Workshop. For a guide to the arbitration process, see Wikipedia:Arbitration/Guide to arbitration. For the Arbitration Committee, Dreamy Jazz ^{talk to me | my contributions} 13:04, 21 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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done. North8000 (talk) 15:31, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 13:44, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 20:39, 22 August 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 00:09, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 00:13, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 14:18, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

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Done. Active there already. North8000 (talk) 16:33, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 16:36, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

@North8000: We have spoken before about the Carmel Development Company Building and the Edward G. Kuster articles, and I know you are interested in California History. Please check out the Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Carmel Valley Historical Society and add your 2 cents to keep the article. I think the article has merit and should not be deleted. Any help you can be provide would be appreciated. Thanks! Greg Henderson (talk) 22:23, 28 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Greghenderson2006: I'd be happy to take a look and see what I think. In your approach to these things I'd suggest reading WP:Canvassing so that your efforts will be in compliance with that guideline. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 14:59, 29 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, sorry about my approach, this has been pointed out to me. Just wanted to loop you into the discussion. Greg Henderson (talk) 15:04, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hello friend. Your user talk page is lagging my computer a bit. If you ever want me to set up bot archiving for you, just let me know, would be happy to help. Happy editing. –Novem Linguae (talk) 02:42, 31 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the reminder. I'll do some housecleaning. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 03:24, 31 August 2023 (UTC)

I whacked over 1/2 of it. North8000 (talk) 03:41, 31 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for the thanks, but it wasn't me who wrote it. It seems the page curation tool needs to be made a bit smarter about identifying who did the work. Yes, my edit is the first, but all I did was make a redirect for a redlink. I didn't flesh it out. The credit lies with Reubot. Kerry (talk) 21:37, 31 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Kerry Raymond: Thanks for the post. I know that sometimes that is the case but it also puts the message on the talk page of the article. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 12:12, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

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Please be a bit careful when nominating players that have hundreds of top-flight appearances in populous countries, as you did to Mohamed El Amine Hammia. You need to do a WP:BEFORE search in the respective language of the subject to find the best results. Paul Vaurie (talk) 17:27, 2 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Z@Paul Vaurie: If the sources exist, why don't you just put them in the article instead of writing posts like this? North8000 (talk) 22:06, 2 September 2023 (UTC)

What in the world are you talking about? You nominated the article for deletion. I am showing that there are sources, and that the subject passes WP:GNG. I don't have to go and add them into the article. We are evaluating the subject's notablity, not the quality of the article. Please review WP:BEFORE and WP:AFD. Paul Vaurie (talk) 22:11, 2 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

See my previous post. If you think so, then put them into the article and settle it. North8000 (talk) 22:14, 2 September 2023 (UTC)

Hello North8800,

There a lot of similar pages in Wikipedia. i.e. Liverpool F.C. in international football, 1. FC Köln in European football, etc. Could you please explain me why are you thinking of deleting this page?

Magawla61 (talk)

The reasons were the ones that I gave at the AFD. If you mean responding to the "similar pages" point that you made, when IMO there is pretty clearly a problem, I don't consider the face that other similar ones exist to be a reason to change that. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 17:59, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

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Done North8000 (talk) 16:11, 13 September 2023 (UTC)

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Done. North8000 (talk) 14:29, 15 September 2023 (UTC)

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Could you please stop with sarcastic comments like these? [4] [5] They are not helpful. This is inappropriate behavior for a contentious topic area. ––FormalDude (talk) 22:13, 20 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@FormalDude: I had a purpose in mind, and chose a lighthearted/indirect way to pursue it. (Rather than a direct nasty overreach like accusing of accusing a particular editor of "Making a habit out of" and "disruptive") Either way I don't plan to do any more of those there. Sincerely. North8000 (talk) 03:00, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

Sorry you felt I was nasty, that was not my intent. I've changed the heading. ––FormalDude (talk) 04:44, 21 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@FormalDude: Thanks. I Updated with the strike. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 10:49, 21 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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